Record Live Podcast

How to pray without ceasing
Intro: [00:00:00] Hi there, everyone. I'm Jared. And I'm Zanita. We are your hosts of Record Live, a podcast where we talk about church, faith, and living well. We believe as followers of Jesus, faith is more than just a set of beliefs. It's a way of life, something we put into practice. Let's go live.
Zanita Fletcher: Hello everyone and welcome to another week of Record Live. Jared, you were just telling me that your children are learning about emotions and so instead of asking how you are, maybe you can just show us this week. How are you feeling
Jarrod Stackelroth: tonight? Pretty good, Sunita. How are, how are you? Because you're living on the Gold Coast and an area that has been inundated with rain and heavy winds and craziness. So how are you doing? [00:01:00]
Zanita Fletcher: Uh, I'm doing good. Yeah. Last week for Record Live,, things were just starting to get a bit more intense. Like as we were having the conversation, the trees were definitely blowing a lot more and I wasn't sure if I was just going to get cut off. , but yeah, I, we did well. Like, I mean, it was.
At least where I am, it was a lot more underwhelming than they expected. So, yeah. After the cyclone had happened, everyone was like, did that really happen? Is anything, is that it? Like, , so yeah,, heaps of rain and heaps of wind. But, thankfully our area is pretty good. There's not a lot of damage.
Yeah, I don't know that many people who really suffered or lost much, which is amazing. So, , yeah,
Jarrod Stackelroth: probably the answer to many prayers. And we're going to talk about prayer today, just to see.
Zanita Fletcher: We are. So we're talking about prayer today. , this is, we sort of had a conversation about this yesterday, but it's also kind of hinging off an editorial that you wrote recently.
And, , something that you brought up yesterday was that, , and you mentioned this in your editorial as well, is that someone handed you [00:02:00] a book about prayer and you were kind of like, oh, I don't know if I want to read this. , and I guess just to start off, it'd be interesting to know,, you mentioned in your editorial that other spiritual books do kind of pique your interest, but when it comes to one on prayer, you were not so interested.
Zanita Fletcher: So what's going on there? Like, why does a book about prayer, , not intrigue you and not interest you? And what's kind of in your experience, with prayer, essentially.
Jarrod Stackelroth: Yeah, well, it's actually coming out in this Sabbath's record that's coming out. , so look out for that in your churches this weekend.
: It should be up on the website today. I think, , it was going to be scheduled just in case you want to read it. So we'll share the link , in the comments. So Nina, I did share that I wasn't super excited about the book. I don't know. It's not just that it was about prayer. It's more like just certain Christian books just have that, just the way they're designed, the sort of.
They promise a lot, like, this book is going to help you revolutionize your spiritual life and that sort of thing, and I was like, uh, [00:03:00] So, for me, I guess it's a design style even preference. It's just, it felt a bit self help y. I was like, I don't want a self help book on prayer. , it just didn't, it just didn't reach out and grab me, neither the title, nor the author I'd never heard of before, or the book itself, the design of it.
So, I was guilty of judging the book by its cover. I'll admit that we always say don't do that, but , we do. It's what we make our decisions on. We see a book and we go, Hey, that's a book I'd like to read or not so much. This one was in the not so much category,
Zanita Fletcher: but I did. I
Jarrod Stackelroth: did. I gave it a crack. It was from my mother.
: Actually, it wasn't just some random person handed me a book because my mum had given it to me. I think, you know, out of respect for her and maybe just looking for something on a Sabbath afternoon that could be,, uplifting or interesting. I was just, yeah, I think I just, [00:04:00] I'm not sure why I started reading.
But when I started reading, I found it quite, , practical and actually interesting, surprisingly interesting. I was like, Oh, this is actually maybe something I should read. So it took me a little while to get through it, but it was quite a, yeah, it was quite a, I would say it helped me to intentionally think about prayer, more intentionally think about prayer.
Zanita Fletcher: Can you elaborate on that a little bit?
Jarrod Stackelroth: Often. I've tried techniques in my life, right? I think we all have to get the terms are very, , it's not right. It doesn't feel right to say this, but get better at prayer, right? So I've tried different things and I have my own things that work or I have my own times where I find it easier to pray or less easy to pray.
, and sometimes that will be. a regular thing in my life, like it'll happen for a long time. Like that's just my default prayer setting. And some things will just be for a season. I'll find it really helpful. I'll try it and [00:05:00] it'll go away and I won't find myself doing it at some point. And it'll be like, Oh, I'm not doing that so much anymore.
, I guess with , the idea of intentionality in prayer, it was like, , so often we ask for things. And that's good. But are we tracking the outcome of those things? And so how do we stay intentional about actually understanding the story that God is telling in our lives through prayer and the story that we're part of in our prayer, in a sense, hooking us into that story.
: So, for example, we will often pray a prayer and that the outcome might. The thing might happen. , it may not be quite the way we expect or the answer we desire. Exactly. It'll change, but we look back at our lives, maybe three years down the track and we go, huh, I was really in a sticky situation and I got out of it.
[00:06:00] Like God must've helped me. Cause I was praying about that really, , clearly, this book. The part that I really resonated or I enjoyed was like, well, actually, we should be more intentional about how we pray. So we can see ourselves as part of that larger story that we are part of and see how God is leading us through both through prayer and through our story to actually, yeah, keep track of some of those.
prayer wins, prayer losses, prayer experiences. , that makes it obviously that makes it easier to share with others to tell other people about. It makes it easier for us to see God's hand in our own lives. And we've talked about difficult seasons or doubts on this show before, like when you hit those sticky patches, you've got it, you've got stories, you've got experiences that you can lean on and say, God led me through this. I know I can get through the next one sort of thing.
Zanita Fletcher: Yeah, I think a lot of people can probably relate to when [00:07:00] things aren't going well, or life is chaotic or something difficult is happening. People tend to really lean on prayer and just absorb themselves in that or they just praying constantly about this certain situation or thing or whatever.
But when at least this is what I find when life is going pretty good. When, , I'm just in the normal day to day routine of life, that's when I just start to pray. less because there's not much of a like, I don't have that motivation to be like, please help me with this, please do this, or like this urgent kind of request.
, but I think what you're saying is that, , remembering the prayers that he's answered for is really like key in this time. Like when life is going well, I think that's when it's really important to kind of like remember not just the prayers he's answered, but also , remember all the people out there who life isn't going so great for and all the people who , are struggling with other things and all the people who we don't even know who are dealing with things and Remembering like what we're actually here to do So I don't know that remember word is like really important I think in our prayer lives when when we've lost [00:08:00] that Motivation or that spark for prayer, I suppose.
Jarrod Stackelroth: Yeah, I I think , you know the idea of praying not just for Your own self, but for other people as well. This was something that really stood out to me in this book, , intentionally praying for specific, like long term prayers. Like I was thinking reading this book, I need to start praying about my children's future spouses because they're the same age potentially as my children.
Now they're growing up. I want them to have good. You know, Christian upbringings and formative years so that they don't maybe have some of the trauma or the baggage that, you know, , some of us always bringing stuff into relationships, but some stuff is harder than other stuff to deal with. And God uses all of it, I'm sure, but, , I have the opportunity to pray in a long term strategic way for, ,and that sounds very calculated when I say it out loud, [00:09:00] but like.
We can't underestimate the power of prayer in helping people find direction and find long term passions and that sort of thing. I think a verse that we hear a lot when we talk about prayer is pray without ceasing. When I say pray without ceasing, and that was Paul, I think it was in Thessalonians
1 Thessalonians chapter 5, verse 17 says pray without ceasing. What does that mean to you Zanita? Because it seems like, is Paul exaggerating, like hyperbolizing, , you should pray all the time, like praying's good, , do it? Or is he actually literally, is there a way we can actually become more frequent, more consistent pray ers?
Zanita Fletcher: Yeah, I think so. I think, , there's a difference. Like, we don't always have to be praying with our knees on the ground and our hands clasped by our bed, like that stereotypical image of praying next to our beds, but I think we can, , I think we're learning more that we [00:10:00] can just pray, like, wherever we are, and that can be, like, in our head, and it'll still be heard, and it'll be out loud, and it'll still be heard.
So, I think the ideal is,, It's kind of like pray as you go about life. So when something comes to mind or you're in the office and something happens or you think of something or like when you're with your children, like while you're interacting with them, you can still be like praying in your mind.
Like it doesn't have to be such a like. routine act that we do like once a day or three times a day. It can just be a continuous thing that we do and that we carry in all different areas of our life. Like, I think that's probably,, that would be my ideal at least. And that's probably how God would like, he'd probably rather us just pop in here and there and like.
Him to be on our minds constantly than just like five minutes in the morning. Does that make sense?
Jarrod Stackelroth: So like not partitioning prayer and God off into one tiny corner of our lives, but yeah
Zanita Fletcher: Yeah, I
think it is still [00:11:00] I still find it really helpful to have those longer times of, , prayer that are more intentional, I suppose, , to really set aside, , ten minutes or something, and to pray about various things or pray about one thing, but I think it's awesome when we really, , carry that out and bring God in throughout our whole days, and, , I constantly talk to him, because it's like when you have a friend or when you have, a new girlfriend or boyfriend or whatever, and you just want to, tell them everything you're doing, , I just had this awesome experience.
Like sandwich for lunch. It was so good. Or , I just heard this, or this just happened. You're just constantly messaging them and you constantly want to be updating them and talking to them and telling them what's going on. I think God probably wants that same kind of, yeah, that closeness with us.
, and that's how, that's what prayer is all about. It's like having a relationship with God and letting him in on things. So, , that would be, , my thoughts.
Jarrod Stackelroth: I guess on that note, what is prayer? You could take it back to if we're to pray without ceasing, we have to understand what prayer is. do you want to hazard a definition for us? What is a [00:12:00] prayer?
Zanita Fletcher: I think in its simplest terms, prayer is just talking to God. That can be like bringing a request. That can be, Thanksgiving, that can be, well, anything, like, I think it's just talking to God, simply. I don't know if we have to make that more difficult.
Jarrod Stackelroth: Is it just talking to God? Is it silence before God? Can God, can we be praying just
quietly contemplating nature or, I don't know.
Zanita Fletcher: I guess, I don't know if that would be called something else, technically, but,
Jarrod Stackelroth: Communicating with God. Yeah,
Zanita Fletcher: still spending time with God, and I guess it's just a different form of connection. I suppose. , I have a question for you, Jared. Okay. When we're talking about praying without ceasing, , obviously you're talking about your kids before and praying for their futures, and I'm sure this is something like, not even their, like, future [00:13:00] 20 years down the road, but just their future in one year, five years.
I'm sure that's something you. care about. , but what is it that stops you from praying? And not just specifically about your children, but what is it that stops you from praying like regularly? Or what is it that you find difficult about maintaining like a consistent prayer life with God? Not pointing you out, I think you suck at prayer, but, , No, no, I think
Jarrod Stackelroth: we all have our shortcomings.: I think, I think busyness gets in the way sometimes. What I've been trying to do is when I'm stressing about something, it's the end of the long day. You can get trapped in a bit of rumination. You know, what do I have to do tomorrow? How do I have to, including God in those conversations in my head is.
Helpful. Like, God, I'm thinking about this tomorrow. Like, I've got to do this, got to do that. , I'm stressed about it. I'm feeling stressed about it. How about you take it? How about you help me with it? You know, how about you just, [00:14:00] and I give it to him and it helps, actually helps me to maybe fall asleep because you're lying there thinking over things and whatever.
So. Well, busyness and stress and some of those factors often can block us from praying. I think they can also be avenues to look, Hey, that could be a prayer for me. , business and stress is quite a common one you mentioned before. Sometimes it's easier to pray in difficult times. And so on the flip side of that, it's like when we actually have things too good.
We're very comfortable. I often reflect when I'm about to go away for holidays, , Oh, I need to find a way to take God with me on holidays. Sounds a weird thing to say, but you can have fun. You can wake up late, , you might not be in your normal routine. So you wake up late, you go for a swim.
You read a book and you're relaxing, you're trying to de stress and not to worry. But it's also [00:15:00] very easy not to then set aside time for prayer or for Bible study, etc. Like, you might have people to see, you're visiting relatives, you're in another country or another state or , you're doing whatever.
And so, being too comfortable can be a barrier to prayer, I think. , In my own life, I see that being too comfortable, being too busy. , many of these things are excuses. We can find ways to do that, but human nature, we're susceptible to, having weaknesses, , and sometimes we forget to pray.
Zanita Fletcher: I can definitely resonate with that feeling of going on holidays or being also too relaxed.
But yeah, , I think it's also probably, I think for me, it's also like the, even when I, try and pray like mindfully, , there's just so many distractions. And I'm not just meaning like screens or books. It's just , distractions as in thoughts. So I'll start praying and then all of a sudden my mind will go in this direction because I've got to think about this and then my mind will go in that direction.
've got to think about [00:16:00] this and then it just is everything is fighting for my attention. So , I find it a struggle to just . rest my mind and keep focused on prayer. But I don't
Jarrod Stackelroth: think as I get older, I'm less stressed about that. I think God would prefer me to be in an attitude of trying to come to him and getting distracted, but coming back, , I'm lying in bed at night and I'm trying to pray, but I fall asleep or I.
I'm in and out of sleep. So I'm praying a bit and then I'm napping and then I'm, Oh, I'm praying again or trying to wake up in the morning. You do the same thing. Sometimes you start to pray and then you're like a bit groggy or something. And it's like, well, actually I think God would prefer me trying to connect with him and, even maybe giving him some of those distracting intrusive sort of thoughts and just like sharing them with him.
Then not trying at all going, Oh, I'm too distracted. So I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna bother or you know [00:17:00] we get the impression of God sometimes that he's this angry headmaster who's like, if we're talking in class, if we're distracted from the task at hand, he's not going to actually listen , or value our prayers.
And I actually don't that God is like that. I'm thinking about how hard it is to have a conversation with my wife at the moment, but we don't stop trying, like my kids interrupt, they want. Or they want to be part of it. Or they're like, I was talking first. And you're like, well, actually we started talking and you're just interrupting. It doesn't mean I stopped talking to my wife. Cause it's too hard to have a conversation with her. , we pick up the conversation when and how we can, we, we try to connect. I think it's the same with God. He wants to connect with us and even distractions like. Kids thoughts coming into our mind, distracting us, , asking for things we're making the effort to pray.
And I think that's part of what God longs for. He longs to. Connect with us [00:18:00] in, you know, ideally, I , was thinking about heaven the other day. What would heaven be like? And I think it's like prayer in a sense is trying to connect with God and keeping getting interrupted in this world.
Like there's a lot of in for interruptions, but heaven feels like it might be more of a communion with God whenever and however we want, like. Eternal, eternal connection, eternal ability to connect with God and have him as a part of our lives. , yeah,
Zanita Fletcher: sure.
Jarrod Stackelroth: Yeah.
Zanita Fletcher: Hopefully there won't be as many distractions in heaven. Well, well, the awesome thing about being in heaven is that we'll have like a physical, physical human to spend time with. I think that's pretty epic, but some good advice someone told me about prayer. They were like. Keep it simple, keep it real, and keep it up. , which I guess is just that idea of like we were just talking about before, you don't have to necessarily just kneel down by your bed and pray in the morning, and that's it.
: [00:19:00] Like, you can keep it simple. It can be like, in the car, or as you're walking, or wherever. Keep it real is , be honest with what you're going through and your feelings. It doesn't have to be a, how art thou, or, giveth thee highly bread, like it's It can also be like expletives and it can also be like, honest, like tears, I suppose. And then keep it up. It's like, keep it up through the distractions, keep it up when it's difficult to pray. , so I thought that was just a cool thing to keep in mind for prayers. I think the essence is spending time with God and like you said, he's really outstanding.
Jarrod Stackelroth: I really like that comment and it's It's very much in the modern sort of parlance.
I found this quote, which I put in my editorial, not to steal too much of my own thunder, but from Ellen White, it says very much the same thing or a similar thing. It says cultivate the habit of talking with the savior. When you are alone, when you are walking, when you are busy with your daily labor, let the heart be continually [00:20:00] uplifted in silent petition for help, for light, for strength, for knowledge, let every breath be a prayer, which is very much like Pray without ceasing to go , back to that point.
, But also to what you're saying, , keep it up, keep it real, keep it raw, keep it up, make it happen. Like, I think, , Auntie Ellen's saying the same thing in that, , whatever you're doing. Wherever you're going, Paul says, do everything for the glory of God, whether you're working, going in, going out, doing all the things, do it for God's glory.
And I think it's the same with prayer. , Stay connected, look for little opportunities during the day , to do that. Do you find, have any practices or, I like to avoid. formulate prayers at some seasons in my life. It is actually helpful to have, a format for prayer, following certain styles of prayer or praying through certain the Lord's prayer or [00:21:00] something like that. Have you found any practices or. Styles, format, are particularly helpful for you? Worthwhile?
Zanita Fletcher: Um, a few things. I think there was one period where , I was really struggling to pray. So I just had this, I literally saw a prayer that someone had written out once. I don't know if they'd put it on Instagram or something.
, and it was just like this 10 line prayer. really resonated with me and so sometimes I would just read that because it was like, it was true and I really didn't mean those things. It wasn't necessarily my own words but , when I found it difficult I just read that and there's hundreds of, you can buy prayer books and it's just prayers that you can read and so I think that's something that can be helpful when you're struggling.
I think another thing that's been good for me is having like a place of prayer. , and that doesn't have to be anything crazy. That could just be like a chair that you find comfortable, or it could be when you're walking your dog or it could be your car or whatever. I have a particular beach that I go to [00:22:00] that's like dead quiet.
: Like there's often nobody there. , and so I really like going there like once a week and just like walking without like headphones, , just like praying. I find it really helpful to pray out loud. So I think having a place can be, , I dunno, it can just make it easier. It can kind of be that place where you hang out with God and kind of put you in the zone a little bit.
So,, I think that's probably what's been helpful for me, but what about you? Did you pick up any tips from the book? Or is there anything that you have found helpful?
Jarrod Stackelroth: It wasn't from the book, but it was last year and it was, Around the time I was reading the book. And so it's kind of connected. I picked up a habit called morning pages.
I'm trying to write, journal, reflect in the morning before I start my day. , it doesn't have to be in the morning. Sometimes I've done it at other times of day, but it is actually quite nice to start the day in that space. And I often find that if I'm self reflecting [00:23:00] or worrying about an issue or just want to write.
About something. It often turns into a prayer. Intentionally, I look for ways to turn it into a prayer. By the time I'm finished, it's like, well, that's an interesting sort of self reflection or that's an interesting scenario that happened to me that I've now written about. Gotten out of my system a little bit, but also, Hey God, can you just take this for yourself?
Like, take it off me, take it with you or, Hey God, I'm really grateful. I'm really blessed about this that I've been talking about, in my reflections, like, wow. I have been blessed. I have been healed or helped through this situation. So thanks God, , praise, praise you for doing that for me.
So, , yeah, I find that is a, a more formal practice that, , it's not always prayer, but I see it , as a prayer and I try and [00:24:00] make it a prayer when I'm practicing it, it naturally goes that way for me. I think I'm, Even if I start writing and something is not spiritual, I'll often end up in that place because God's just done so much in my life and I just, yeah, I just need him to help me process.
Jarrod Stackelroth: Stuff. So it's often where I end up,
Zanita Fletcher: I think that's cool. I think there's so many people have loved this morning pages thing. If anyone's never heard of it, Google it. And yeah, there's a book about it. I believe probably website or something, but I think that's the cool thing about pros. There's so many ways to get creative with it.
There's so many different things we can do. There's like probably thousands of different tools or exercises out there that people have created or resourced or tried or whatever.
And I think that's the difficulty or the danger. Sometimes the challenge for us is to think there's one correct way to pray.
Like, I [00:25:00] should use this format or this particular method, or I have to Do such and such a prayer and then read my Bible and then pray again for this amount of time or this amount of we can get to, , caught up in the logistics or the details of how should I pray. And I think this was some of my resistance to this book.
I was like, Oh, this will just be another model or method that I'm supposed to follow. It'll teach me about prayer to, to, impose something, some new restriction in my life. But. And it didn't turn out to be like that, but I think we can fall into the danger of a feeling overwhelmed. There's so many methods.
I don't know which one to choose. And so we paralyzed by choice too much choice or be we. , told or we think or it's enforced, there's this one way you've got to pray. You should really pray like that. If you can't do that, you're not making it , in a prayer life. You're [00:26:00] not a prayer warrior., you're failing at prayer. I think there is as many different ways to pray as there are people on the planet. Like everyone connects with God in their own unique way. And I think God talks to us all in, in different ways. And so, . Yes, there are some probably key, things that are useful and there are definitely, you know, , this book mentioned, , praying the scriptures, which I probably don't do enough, finding Bible verses and meditating on them and actually praying them into my life, potentially, or the lives of people around me.
It's a concept I'd love to do more of or to try to experiment with. So , there's useful things, there's, these are useful techniques, but they're not, there's not one right way, correct way to pray.
Zanita Fletcher: I think that's a cool, a kind of cool thing to leave people with those, . So perhaps this week, like try something that you haven't tried when it comes to prayer.
: And even if you are lost for things to do, Google what other [00:27:00] people have done or , ask a friend or a family member, like what's like something that you find helpful, , praying consistently.
Jarrod Stackelroth: And we'll check next week, Zenita, we can check.
Zanita Fletcher: Accountability is key. Yeah. Ask me next week what I've done differently.
I'll do the same.
Jarrod Stackelroth: Sounds good. We've run out of time.
Zanita Fletcher: So quick. It's been
Jarrod Stackelroth: very quick this week.
Zanita Fletcher: I hope people have found that interesting. If anyone has any, , creative ways that they like to pray or just not even necessarily super creative, but just things that they find helpful, , in having an unceasing prayer life, we would love to know, so let us know in the comments or send us a message and yeah, we look forward to hearing from you.
: But I think that's about it. We've been pretty practical in this episode, so I don't know if we need to land the plane with another practical one, but, Yeah, I guess we'll just end it there. But we will see you all next week, of course, on Record Live , Wednesday at 4 p. m. , until then stay safe and yeah, we'll see you soon.
Jarrod Stackelroth: God bless. [00:28:00]